Natalio Botana: "Leo XIV pointed out the path that democracy should take in Argentina"

What message did Leo XIV leave during his visit to Argentina? Natalio Botana, one of the country's great intellectuals, summarizes it as follows: "There is here a vision of democracy founded on the common good, founded on care for the word, on the search for agreement, on the effort to ensure that dialogue prevails over conflict." In his view, "what is extraordinary about this man, and in general about the Church's social doctrine, is that there is no allusion to individuals, to rulers: there is allusion to the fundamental concepts of good democratic governance." For the Pope, Botana argues, one must not disconnect factual violence of weapons or repression from the violence of the word. "The issue of verbal violence and the war of words is at the very origin of his pontificate," he adds. Botana praises the Pope's recovery of the Church's social doctrine, values the balance, sobriety, and depth of his message and the simplicity of his expression. And he emphasizes: "In Uruguay, the Pope celebrated 40 years of democracy. In Argentina, on the other hand, he did not celebrate; rather, he pointed out the path that democracy must take or should take," says Botana, a political scientist, historian, author of El orden conservador and Repúblicas y monarquías (Edhasa), among many other classics. In Leo XIV, says Botana, there is "an injection of piety into a conflictive world." And he acknowledges that what he has left in these days in Argentina is a moment of peace. "Even so, I want to be very precise here and I will speak a bit as a historian. The great historical challenge facing countries is that these moments of concord, of profound fraternity, of profound integration of one with another, become prolonged processes," he stresses. He recalls other papal visits and "great moments of Catholic presence whose enthusiasms faded." -The Pope exercises a spiritual, moral, political leadership. Could you paint a portrait of Leo XIV? -It is not easy to paint a portrait, but he is evidently a very attractive personality because of the sense of balance he conveys in his judgments, because of his acts oriented toward charity in the Christian sense and, above all—one of the things I most admire in him—because of the way he has recovered the Church's social doctrine which, as we all know, was born with the encyclical Rerum Novarum, by Leo XIII. We see how this social doctrine of the Church, which took shape fundamentally throughout the 20th century, now confronts the crucial dilemmas of this 21st century. In that sense, for me and for many non-believing friends, the encyclical Magnifica Humanitas, published by Leo XIV in May of this year, is exemplary. Natalio Botana, at his home Pilar Camacho - LA NACION "Leo XIV is a very attractive personality because of the sense of balance he conveys in his judgments, because of his acts oriented toward charity and, above all, because of the way he has recovered the Church's social doctrine" -One could say the Pope has a sober style, without stridency, but at the same time he is seen as very connected to emotions, to what makes us human. His message is profound and surgical, but clear and accessible. -And there is something admirable: he has a very important simplicity of expression. For a reason he is the Pontiff of the Catholic Church. It is the evangelical tradition of being closer to the excluded, to the poor. His visit to the Cottolengo Don Orione to be close to the disabled, close to those who are outside normalized society, is a tradition that comes from early Christianity and that this man renews extraordinarily in this 21st century. So there is an arc that runs from the great meditations on, for example, artificial intelligence—one of the great themes of the 21st century—where he has left fundamental concepts, to the most concrete themes, the closest ones, to humanity, to the drama of the excluded, to the drama of those who are outside a more complete life, right? In that sense, I believe there is a very beautiful lesson based on two fundamental criteria: humility, on the one hand, and prudence, on the other. -What is your view of the Pope's public interventions on Argentine soil? -I would like to focus on the speech, so important to me, that he delivered at the Palacio Libertad before the President and the Argentine political class in general, not as well represented as happened in Uruguay, whose democratic and republican quality is far superior to ours. This message at the Palacio Libertad is central to me because it deals very precisely with the political form of democracy. Leo XIV speaks at the Palacio Libertad before Javier Milei and other representatives of Argentine politics Presidency -There he referred, among other topics, to care for public speech in democratic coexistence, to the value of dialogue and the willingness to listen to the other, to recognition of those who think differently. You yourself have expressed concern about the verbal violence of these times. You have referred to the "barbarity of the word." -Yes. Evidently, there is here a vision of democracy founded on the common good, founded on care for the word, on the search for agreement, on the effort to ensure that dialogue prevails over conflict. That is a very great doctrinal effort that clashes, in a constructive sense, with the moral sense of politics. Because politics is the pursuit of power and that pursuit of power implies conflicts that can be moderated by good institutions, as the Pope points out, or else taken to degrees of intensity like those we have suffered and habitually suffer in Argentina. He points out that these principles can be translated into concrete facts. And there are principles here that are valid not only for the Christian tradition, but that are valid for all the traditions of those of us who strive to have a democracy worthy of the name, in the sense of the ontological dignity of the person. That is an immense value that must be defended to the utmost. In addition, also of the highest value, are human rights, without which that dignity of the person cannot be effectively implemented in everyday life. It is interesting that in recent years social justice has come to be considered a deplorable, despicable principle. And social justice responds to a very noble tradition in political thought that begins in ancient Greece with Aristotle, which is the principle of distributive justice. There is commutative justice, which is giving each his due, but there is also distributive justice, which is the capacity of a social, economic and political order to give, to offer, particularly to the most fragile, a truly human life, a life that dignifies us not only as individuals, but that dignifies us as members of a democratic community that seeks to perfect itself through these principles. I believe this message has been of extraordinary importance. Natalio Botana Pilar Camacho - LA NACION "It is interesting that in recent years social justice has come to be considered a deplorable, despicable principle" -He also referred to the search for agreements with neighboring countries, to dialogue, collaboration and integration at a time when Mercosur is creaking and Argentina has a delicate relationship with Brazil. "Thinking about the future of Argentina therefore also leads to looking toward the peoples with whom it shares this continent," he said. -It is very clear. In Uruguay the Pope celebrated 40 years of Uruguayan democracy and did so, moreover, in Artigas Square with very beautiful metaphors about what the Artigas monument represented, a national hero for Uruguayans and also for Argentines. In Argentina, on the other hand, he did not celebrate; rather, he pointed out the path that democracy must take or should take. This is interesting because evidently in the language and in the use of the word of Leo XIV there is such a subtle style, a style so much in search of the balance of concepts and fundamental principles, that one would have to read between the lines and with great care. What is he indicating with much prudence and much piety, in the Christian sense of the word? That one must tread carefully. -In what sense? -There is a kind of call for attention to the care that democracy has for us and the care that we must give to democracy, and a call, of course, for peace. When he refers to the word, I always remember this concept that is in the encyclical, in Magnifica Humanitas, which says: "Let us disarm the word and help to disarm the earth." There is great depth in this, and he says it in this sense: that "the war of words" of which he also speaks can translate, and in fact historically has translated, into a factual war, a war of elimination that at this moment is spreading across many points of the planet because of this rebirth we are suffering of geopolitics taken to its greatest extremes, whose most archetypal figures at this moment are Trump in the United States and Putin in Russia. That is most interesting: one must not disconnect the factual violence of weapons or repression from the violence of the word. They are two things that go together, and it seems to me that in this message from last Sunday the effort of Leo XIV is very clear. The issue of verbal violence and the war of words is at the very origin of his pontificate. This is a problem that is already universal, because evidently politics as insult was not necessarily born in Argentina; it was also born in the United States with Trump and in other countries. What is extraordinary about this man, and in general about the Church's social doctrine, is that there is no allusion to individuals, to rulers. -He does not personalize. He does not speak of individuals but of ideas. -Exactly. There is allusion to the fundamental concepts of good democratic governance. That is the idea of the Church's social doctrine: a set of principles and criteria of good action, among them discernment, linked to action. The duty of the action of each of the people who populate the vast universe of democracy is to transform those principles into institutions and concrete political actions. It is very interesting to see what has happened with social justice. This concept of social justice we have discussed can have a populist translation, as has been the appropriation that Peronism made of social justice since the mid-20th century. But also, as I had occasion to observe in my long life some sixty-odd years ago in postwar Europe, the extraordinary effort of democratic reconstruction made in Europe, precisely through integration, is inspired by a democratic and non-populist translation of social justice. It converges with other great traditions: the European reconstruction is carried out by the Christian democratic tradition inspired by the Church's social doctrine, the social democratic tradition, inspired by the democratic concept of socialism, and the postwar new liberal tradition, also inspired by the defense of human rights and the welfare state. The institutional and political translation of the principles bequeathed by the Church's social doctrine, and in particular by this message of such an attractive Pope, is interesting. -In Leo XIV there is a deeply humanistic imprint, with values that embody solidarity, empathy and sensitivity. But that message, said at this moment and in this place, takes on an exceptional character. In other circumstances they would be sensible, but "normal," words. In today's Argentina, that restatement is extraordinary. -What Leo XIV has left in these days in Argentina is a moment of peace. There is no doubt. My children, my grandchildren have gone to those fabulous, massive gatherings. I followed it on television, but it was very clear that there was a profound sense of solidarity and unity. Even so, I want to be very precise here and I will speak a bit as a historian. These are moments. The great historical challenge facing countries is that these moments of concord, of profound fraternity, of profound integration of one with another, become prolonged processes. Natalio Botana Mariana Araujo "What Leo XIV has left in these days in Argentina is a moment of peace" -One wonders what marks this will leave, if it leaves any, what it will sediment. Ultimately, whether it will be a milestone in historical terms. -We have historically had great moments of Catholic presence in the country. I remember the famous gathering that took place in Argentina in 1934, with the presence of Cardinal Pacelli, who a few years later would be Pope Pius XII. That gathering was, at that time, of enormous fraternity, but if one looks at the Argentine political process after those years, one sees that the enthusiasms of that moment also faded, don't they? And the same happened with the second visit of John Paul II. It was also a massive phenomenon, a marvelous fraternity, and in 1987, 1988, we were on the verge of new political crises, of new confrontations, of processes that would continue to deepen despite the great intentions of the Alfonsín government. So one must pay close attention to this: to gather with enthusiasm what these moments of fraternity mean, but to be aware that what matters in the process of nations is not so much the moment as the prolongation of that moment into constructive processes. -Another interesting question is whether the Pope was able to enable a different public conversation, with topics that deserve to be named without being insulted or accused of being communist, such as human dignity, disability, social justice, the economy at the service of man and not the other way around, the search for agreements. We will see what happens over time, won't we? -That responds more to the specifically Christian message, to the evangelical root and to early Christianity. That is very clear: Christ is seeking the established, but fundamentally he is seeking those who are outside. And that message is evidently an injection of piety into a very conflictive world. One walks through the city of Buenos Aires and encounters so many bodies in a process of perpetual slumber due to hunger lying in the street. There are moments of naturalization of these things that are terrible. I would say that the words of Leo XIV, like those of so many other pontiffs—I also remember Francis in particular—are a very profound call for attention. But things become much more complicated when ideologies are injected into the political world and there is a kind of glorification of the idea that individual goods as such will produce a positive effect. And it is demonstrated in the contemporary development of democracy that without a joint action of a State in proper form together with the positive action that creation in the market or great scientific-technological creation can signify, civilization is not possible. Leo XIV is raising the question of what are the possibilities of a civilization capable of integrating public action with private action. The problem is when public action is denatured by the action of corruption. And there is a very clear passage in the message he gave at the Palacio Libertad, that corruption damages human coexistence as much as human trafficking and the trafficking of arms and drugs do. That is, he places these terrible evils of human trafficking, like arms and drug trafficking, on the same level as corruption. And corruption, he says with complete clarity, ends up affecting the fundamental trust that must exist in a society with respect to public powers. This is a fact that transcends mere morality because it concerns the legitimacy that the good conduct of rulers must have in a democracy. Type of work: News Original